Date: February 20, 2009
Verse: Srimad-Bhagavatam 3.24.5
Speaker: Sesa Prabhu

maitreya uvaca
devahuty api sandesam gauravena prajapateh
samyak sraddhaya purusam kuta-stham abhajad gurum

TRANSLATION

Sri Maitreya said: Devahuti was fully faithful and respectful toward the direction of her husband, Kardama, who was one of the Prajapatis, or generators of human beings in the universe. O great sage, she thus began to worship the master of the universe, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, who is situated in everyone’s heart.

PURPORT

This is the process of spiritual realization; one has to receive instruction from a bona fide spiritual master. Kardama Muni was Devahuti’s husband, but because he instructed her on how to achieve spiritual perfection, he naturally became her spiritual master also. There are many instances wherein the husband becomes the spiritual master. Lord Siva also is the spiritual master of his consort, Parvati. A husband should be so enlightened that he should become the spiritual master of his wife in order to enlighten her in the advancement of Krsna consciousness. Generally stri, or woman, is less intelligent than man; therefore, if the husband is intelligent enough, the woman gets a great opportunity for spiritual enlightenment.

Here it is clearly said (samyak sraddhaya) that with great faith one should receive knowledge from the spiritual master and with great faith execute the performance of service. Srila Visvanatha Cakravarti Thakura, in his commentary on Bhagavad-gita, has especially stressed the instruction of the spiritual master. One should accept the instruction of the spiritual master as one’s life and soul. Whether one is liberated or not liberated, one should execute the instruction of the spiritual master with great faith. It is also stated that the Lord is situated in everyone’s heart. One does not have to seek the Lord outside; He is already there. One simply has to concentrate on one’s worship in good faith, as instructed by the bona fide spiritual master, and one’s efforts will come out successfully. It is also clear that the Supreme Personality of Godhead does not appear as an ordinary child; He appears as He is. As stated in Bhagavad-gita, He appears by His own internal potency, atma-maya. And how does He appear? He appears when pleased by the worship of a devotee. A devotee may ask the Lord to appear as her son. The Lord is already sitting within the heart, and if He comes out from the body of a devotee it does not mean that the particular woman becomes His mother in the material sense. He is always there, but in order to please His devotee, He appears as her son.

Sesa Prabhu

So here Maitreya Muni is continuing his description of this rather extraordinary family. A rather extraordinary family, Kardama Muni a Prajapati, his wife Devahuti the daughter of an emperor and Devahuti putra, Kapiladev. In the class that he gave yesterday, His Grace Badrinarayan Prabhu was speaking on a point that is also mentioned by Srila Prabhupada in the purport here today, how crucial acceptance and following of the order of the spiritual master is to the success of our endeavors in spiritual life.

yasya prasadad bhagavat-prasado
yasyaprasadan na gatih kuto ‘pi

Without pleasing the spiritual master and receiving his mercy then there is no fruit. So much endeavour may be there but unless the spiritual master is pleased then, na gatih kuto ‘pi, there is no fruit to that endeavor. This is a crucial point for all of us to understand. It is so crucial that not only do the great acaryas like Srila Visvanath Cakravati Thakur who has given us this instruction, who as Srila Prabhupada in his commentary on Bhagavad-gita also stresses the importance of pleasing the spiritual master.

So not only do big, big acaryas in our line stress this but the Lord Himself instructs the same thing in Bhagavad-gita,

tad viddhi pranipatena pariprasnena sevaya
upadeksyanti te jnanam jnaninas tattva-darsinah - (Bg 4.34)

If you want to know the truth, in other words if you want the fruit, the fruit of your questions that you mat have about spiritual life then you have to approach tattva darsinah - that person who knows the truth, that is guru, he knows the truth. And if you approach with submission and enquiry then you can get the fruit. Otherwise it is not available.

So Lord Krishna instructs us, we hear from the great acaryas, Lord Krishna Himself instructs in Bhagavad-gita and the Lord Himself descends into this material world and He offers a practical example of how to do this. When Lord Sri Ramacandra appeared in this world he was lila-purusottama. He came to enact His pastimes as a human being.

When He went with Visvamitra Muni to the assembly of Maharaj Janak to win the hand of Sita He accepted the method of doing this as a human being just to teach us this lesson, how important it is to accept guru, take blessings from guru to achieve success in any endeavor. There were so many stalwart kings in that assembly, very powerful personalities and in Sita’s svayamvara there was a challenge. Whoever can life the bow and string it, that person will win the hand of Mother Sita.

So Lord Ramacandra was there sitting in that assembly. So many people tried, so many people failed but when it came to be His turn, because you see as lila-purusottama, He is different than Swayam Bhagavan Sri Krishna. When Swayam Bhagavan Sri Krishna went to take Mother Rukmini, He didn’t bother in engaging in competition. He just went and He took. That is His privilege He can take! He is svarat, He is independent but as lila-purusottama, Lord Ramacandra said, “Okay, yes alright, I will accept. I will engage in competition with others.”

His example of how he engaged in competition with others is the reason why He won the hand of Sita, he got the fruit and others didn’t. What did He do when it became His turn? He stood and then He offered His humble pranams to Visvamitra Muni, took his blessing, “Gurudev, you bless me that I may be successful in this endeavor.”

So He was successful, He lifted the bow. He strung it. He won the hand of mother Sita. So this principle of accepting the guru ‘s instruction, pleasing the guru for success in any endeavor is established by the Lord’s personal behavior as lila-purusottama Sri Ramacandra.

Actually, all relationships are meant to facilitate our spiritual advancement. Relationship with guru is there, but every relationship has this same end. This is evidenced by the statements of Rsabhadeva, Lord Rsabhadeva, that are recorded in the fifth canto of Srimad-Bhagavatam. In the fifth canto of Srimad-Bhagavatam, Lord Rsabhadeva in instructing his sons tells them, “Don’t become a guru, don’t become a father, don’t become a mother, don’t become a worshipable demigod unless you can deliver your dependents.”

So we know relationships with guru that is a sacred relationship. Sometimes we think though that relationship with wife, relationship with children, other relationships, somehow or other these relationship don’t have the same end in mind, but Lord Rsabhadeva says, “No, don’t have any of these relationships unless they bear the fruit of liberating your dependents.”

I want to share with you today some experiences that I had recently when I was doing a parikrama in Vrindavan with His Holiness Indradyumna Swami Maharaja and His Holiness BB Govinda Maharaja. They kindly allowed me to accompany them and groups of their disciples on a parikrama during the month of Karttika in Vrindavan and I had a couple of experiences during that parikrama which illustrated this point to me that all relationships are meant to bear this fruit of spiritual realization.

As we were doing parikrama of Govardhan Hill, I saw a man and a wife who were doing the parikrama together, but they had a unique way of doing the parikrama. I think many of you have probably may have seen that someone who does dandavat parikrama. They take a stone and they do the dandavat and they put the stone and they stand up and they move that much forward, they do another dandavat and in that way, they move around the hill. So the man was doing that. He had the stone, he was doing dandavat, placing the stone, standing, and going to the next spot. Behind him was the wife. Every time he bowed down, she touched his feet. He stood up, he moved on, he bowed down and she touched his feet. In this way, they were doing dandavat parikrama together.

We’ve heard the term dharma-patni. Such a wonderful example to see! You can see it yourself. Bhagavatam gives us instruction. If we travel in the holy dham, if we keep our eyes open, we will see so many things that will provide us good instruction. So this man and wife were doing together that.

The other instance was, we were driving in a car going to Varsana. So we stopped at the petrol station. Maybe many of the devotees coming from the western countries have had the experience that the little children, they gather around and they look and they stare. So while we were stopped in the car, I was sitting in the front seat and Indradyumna Swami Maharaja was sitting behind me. So a group of children gathered around and they were staring.

So ever the preacher, Maharaj, Indradyumna Swami Maharaja started a conversation with the boys. And actually one of the boys could speak some English. He had obviously been studying in an English medium school and was able to communicate and so Maharaj was talking to him. He was a very intelligent young boy, maybe about twelve years old. So Maharaj asked him, “You are studying English, what do you plan to do with your life?”

That twelve-year-old boy said something very significant. He said, “I want to do something with my life that will bring good name or good fame to my father’s name. I want to do something with my life that brings honor to my father’s name.” Wow, such a son. Who wouldn’t’ want such a son as that?

Now these people, the husband and the wife and this young boy, they were ordinary people, so-called ordinary people. Obviously their attitude in life was not ordinary, but seemingly ordinary people. They had something, which was very significant in terms of our mission in life and in terms of facilitating the spiritual end of all relationships.

The husband and wife, they worked together and they both achieved the fruit of that parikrama. They achieved the fruit of that parikrama equally as they both endeavored in that way. And the son he achieved a fruit, I’m sure he will achieve the fruit, with that kind of attitude to life of trying to please someone else in life other than one’s own interest. He placed the interest of his father before his own interest. This idea of working together in religious sacrifice as man and wife, a willingness to sacrifice one’ s life for another, these attitudes are extremely helpful for us as we approach what should be the goal of all relationships and that is the goal of attaining the fruit of spiritual advancement.

One other thing that I have just from my own experience because we are talking about relationship of husband and wife, father and son, but there is another relationship that is very valuable, I think maybe most valuable for us as we try to make spiritual advancement in life, and that is the relationship of friendship. I have a friend, and I feel fortunate to be able to say that, that I have a friend. He is a devotee, obviously. He took me aside one time and he said, “Prabhu, I want to say something to you.” He said, “If I ever even think or talk about doing something that destroys or has the potential to destroy my relationship with my wife or if I ever think or say or even do something that would bring ill repute to my spiritual master, Srila Prabhupada, I want you to take me out in the woods and shoot me. Just end my life. My life is in your hands if I ever do anything like that.”

I said, “OK, Prabhu, I’ll do that, but on one condition, that if I ever do any of these things, you’ll take me out there and shoot me.” (Laughter) This is friendship. Friendship means that my life is yours. It is in your hands. You take it. Husband and wife means two lives are one. Son and father means son gives his life for the father. And friend means that my life is your life. If we have these types of relationships, not only do they give a great deal of satisfaction to us, but also they lead us to this fruit of love of Godhead. One of the purposes that His Divine Grace Srila Prabhupada had when he established this International Society for Krishna Consciousness was to create a place where devotees could come together to glorify the supreme Lord Krishna.

I think, I believe, it actually says, “to interact with each other”. There is some word like that there, to interact with each other for the glorification of the Supreme Lord Krishna. So these relationships are important in doing that. If we don’t have these relationships, how will we do that? That is the purpose of all those relationships. But one thing we need to know about relationships and that is that the fruit is the important thing, not necessarily the position in the relationship. The fruit is the important thing. And this is illustrated by Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu Himself. Another time a couple of years ago, I had the fortune to go on a parikrama here in Sri Mayapur Dham in the company of His Holiness Radhanath Swami Maharaja. And we went to Sri Khanda, the village here, not so far. Sri Khanda is the home of the village of two very great devotees, Sri Mukunda Dasa and Raghunandana Thakur. Sri Mukunda Dasa was a very great devotee, he was the father, and his son was Raghunandana.

Mukunda Dasa was such a good devotee that he was a physician; one time he was caring for the Muslim king. It was a little hot in the sun and they brought the peacock fan to shade the king’s head. Upon seeing the peacock fan, Mukunda thought of Krsna and fainted. Immediately the peacock fan invoked such deep spiritual emotion. This was his position as a devotee, his greatness as a devotee. Yet when Caitanya Mahaprabhu asked him, he said, “Mukunda, you are the father and Raghunandana is the son. Is this so?”

So Mukunda said, “My Lord no, actually, Raghunandana is the father and I am the son. Why? Because Raghunandana, he has shown us, he has taught us, he has led us, in understanding and worshiping Krishna, therefore I accept him as the father and I am the son.” This Raghunandana Thakur, you may recall, he is that boy who in worshipping the deity, by his love, actually forced the deity to come and eat the prasad, take it off the plate.

So Caitanya Mahaprabhu said, “Yes, this is correct. This is correct Raghunandana is the father and you are the son because he is guru. Therefore he is the father and you are the son.” So the important thing is not who is father, who is son, but the fruit of love of Godhead, the fruit of understanding Krishna. That is the important thing.

So it is mentioned here in the purport, “Generally stri, or woman, is less intelligent than man; therefore, if the husband is intelligent enough, the woman gets a great opportunity for spiritual enlightenment.” Koi bat nahi, doesn’t matter who is on top, who is on bottom, the important thing is the fruit of love of God. That is the important thing. Caitanya Mahaprabhu has given this instruction.

Actually relationships are kind of a funny thing. As a relationship between Sri Mukunda das and Raghunandan Thakur illustrates, these relationships are kind of a funny thing. Just like we are reading here, studying about this family, Kardama, Devahuti, and Kapila. As Prabhupada makes the point in today’s purport and the previous purport, the Lord likes to be addressed in relation to his devotees, Kapiladev, His name is Devahuti putra, the son of Devahuti. But what do we see in this description? We see that son is instructing the mother. How is this? He is Devahuti putra. How is He instructing the mother? Mother means superior position. She has superior position, Kapiladev has accepted that position therefore He is known as Devahuti putra, how is this? He is instructing his mother because that is the fruit of the relationship.

His Holiness Bhanu Swami Maharaj a few days ago, he was relating this pastime to us in a class that he gave and he explained how Kardama had some desire, it was fulfilled by Krishna in bringing Devahuti. Devahuti has some desires, and they were fulfilled by Kardama. But still she was unsatisfied. Still she had desire. She wanted something more. Because you see, Kardama said, “I will give you children they I will go.”

We also know that Kapiladev, he also left. So poor Devahuti, she is left alone. Is Devahuti left alone? Husband is gone. Son is gone. She is not left alone. Why? She is not left alone because by the instruction of Kapila, she got the fruit of love of Godhead. He gave her instruction. He gave her that and then He left. But leaving is not important. The fruit is important. That remained. That remained!

So Devahuti putra the fruit of that relationship came not as mother superior to son but son instructing mother. Because the fruit was given, love of Godhead was given in the instruction. Then there was no leaving. Devahuti was not left. All her desires were completely satisfied. That fruit is so relishable, amrta, so much nectar, that even today, thousands and thousands and thousands of years later, that fruit is available for us by coming together hearing these instructions, meditating upon them, letting them enrich our relationships. We have relationship, husband and wife, father and son, friend to friend. But what is the basis? The basis of that relationship is this fruit of love of Godhead. And the goal of that relationship is this fruit of love of Godhead. Such a wonderful thing, such a wonderful opportunity that has been afforded to us.

So these are some thoughts that I had about this verse of Srimad-Bhagavatam. We have just a few minutes if there are any comments or questions form our senior god brothers, sannyasis? We can take instruction from you on these subject mattes.

Question: So thank you Sesa Prabhu, such a wonderful class proving your devotion. You mentioned one point that we need to have some friendship, to care for each other as a friend. We need that friendship in Krishna consciousness to keep going in the preaching of Prabhupada’s mission but sometimes we are concerned about so much about position and we are lacking this care and love whose fruit is of love of Godhead, being compassionate, being tolerant as Prabhupada did with us, because we are here, all of us by the mercy of Srila Prabhupada. So how can we improve that relationship as Rupa Goswami says, priti laksana, become compassionate, show more compassion to the new generation? How we can improve that as Prabhupada wanted?

Sesa Prabhu: Well the particular characteristic of the relationship of friend and friend is, is that, I tried to illustrate this in my talk, the characteristic is that it doesn’t matter whether you are on top or on the bottom, whether your friend gave you a slap on your face or gives you an embrace, the friendship does not break

So when we have a position that means that I am going to be broken at some point, then can we have genuine friendship? Not deep friendship. Friendship means I may be on the bottom and I may be crushed, but my friend is not going to abandon me and I am not going to abandon my friend. Nothing is going to push me to that level were I say, “It is broken.”

So I think it starts with us. We have that attitude of acceptance of another. Again that ok, you take my life. We can take at least one person. We may not find many. We may not find everybody. That’s okay! Start with one. If we can have one friend like that, we should consider ourselves very fortunate. It starts with our ability to not put that barrier there at least with one person. With everyone else I will not put it, but with that person, I will not put it, so that person can do anything and I will not abandon him or her and he or she will not abandon me. So just start with one. Big, big society, it may take some time.

Question: I have one realization on one question, Prabhu that as per my personal experience actually I consider every woman in ISKCON more intelligent than me. Even though in the Vedas it is explained that the husband is the guru I consider that my wife is my guru. How can we believe in the Vedic scriptures? You know my personal situation; my wife showed me by example how to live an exemplary life. How can we relate this greatness of the women in our society to the next generations even though it says in scriptures that women are less intelligent than men, even though Srila Prabhupada says that is material women? Spiritual women are not the same. How can we relate this to generations coming into our society so we don’t make the mistakes of the past so we actually see women as worshipable servants of Srimati Radharani instead of our servants?

Sesa Prabhu: I think we need to start on that path by understanding that the fruit of love of Godhead is the goal. That is the important thing, not relative position, higher or lower. That changes anyway. Sometimes we are on top, next moment, we are on the bottom. I think that as a grhastha I can honestly say that sometimes my wife instructs me, sometimes I instruct her. That is the practical dynamic.

It is not caught in just this idea that is there in a statement but that statement is devoid of practical interaction and so if the goal is the fruit, then as I said, koi bat nahi, what difference does it make who is higher who is lower. The point is to develop that fruit of love of love of God. But if we take statements like that and try to exploit them with some other end in mind following instructions of guru, that is not following the instructions of guru because guru means what? It means that, you have to get this fruit otherwise yasya prasad. So we try to concentrate on what the goal is and keep that in mind and let things be put in perspective because of that. Not because of other agendas.

The agenda of the guru is one-to give us love of Godhead and to that end we find ourselves in many different types of relationships. All are mean for this purpose. If we have some other purpose then we may take any statement from the sastra or any instruction from the guru and try to use it this way or that way, but that is not the purpose for what it is mean to be used for. So we have to keep that in mind. If we have that as our perspective then we can perceive and that perceiving may involve lifetimes of trying to understand and endeavor and follow. That I can’t say, but I can say that lets keep the goal of all relationships in mind and that will give us some perspective by which we can go forward, that we know will be pleasing to our spiritual master.

Yes, Mataji.

Subhangi Mataji: Prabhu, what you are saying is the only solution to that statement that women is less intelligent than men, but for preaching why did Srila Prabhupada write this? So many young girls come to the movement and hear this and they say, “No. This is not for me.” We understand, we devotees that the solution what you are saying is the fruit of love is the only thing, the goal, it doesn’t matter who is bigger or smaller but for the preaching mission how could he write that? Questioning my own guru!

Sesa Prabhu: I don’t know if I want put myself in the position of questioning why Srila Prabhupada did anything. The only thing I could only question is why he would accept such a person as myself but we have to try to approach this, and actually we were having some committee meeting yesterday and it was mentioned in that meeting about how we should not try to question the intent of our spiritual master even though we may not understand what he says. There may be many things that we do not understand about Srila Prabhupada’s statements many things at our state of advancement we don’t have complete understanding of and so how to deal with those things? We can deal with those things by losing faith or we can deal with those things by approaching them with humility and patience and endeavor to try to understand those things.

Granted that is hard for new people but if new people see us, all of us that have been serving for forty years whatever, Srila Prabhupada. When they see you how do you respond to that then they think, “Oh she has been year forty years serving Srila Prabhupada and this statement is there but she, I see is such a wonderful person, such a dedicated person.” So they will get the example that is beyond our superficial understanding that may want to make them go away. So we are examples for those that may have doubts. We may have our doubts ourselves but we are staying and we are doing it. That is a powerful example that can tide us over until we come to that understanding.

Vaiyasaki Prabhu: Thank you very much. First I just want to say that your class is very dear to my heart. Now Prabhupada remarked that what he did the others couldn’t do. And what he did was that he saw every person as an eternal servant of Krishna. They may know or may not know. Thus he gave everyone, every women the chance to do what every man can do. So in his Iskcon a woman can do everything that a man can do. That is the highest standard. So my question is this, why is Iskcon in India not presenting the highest standard but is presenting the lower standard that the brahminical class - that women are inferior. Why are we not leading why are we accepting this lower standard. That is my question.

Sesa Prabhu: (Laughs) What I would suggest that you do is put that into a discussion point, put it in the queue for discussion at the GBC meeting next year. (Laughter) Hari Vilas Prabhu will give us the answer to that question.

Vaiyasaki Prabhu: It is too important to wait one year!

Hari Vilas Prabhu: Thank you very much Sesa Prabhu. We derive our behavior and thoughts from our acaryas and the parama acaraya is certainly Caitanya Mahaprabhu. I don’t think anyone will doubt that he knew what the truth was. In his relationship with Haridas Thakur especially when Haridas Thakur was associating with him in Jagannath Puri Lord Caitanya did not oblige Haridas Thakur and walk into the temple of Lord Jagannath. Now we should ask the question why? Because He knew what the truth was. He knew that everyone regardless of their birth is a devotee of Jagannath and should be denied that in any way, but yet His purpose was much greater than simply rearranging the social order or creating a revolution or pounding people who have a lesser understanding.

So instead of forcing the issue of Haridas Thakur entering into the Jagannath temple He personally recognized Haridas as namacarya and a genuine pure devotee of Jagannath and He visited Him in private. And Lord Caitanya is non different that Jagannath Himself!

We can perhaps engage in revolutionary or social upheaval movements but I think what we are looking for is the movement of the heart toward Krishna. No one is denied, whether they are man or woman whether they have this orientation or that orientation, a direct relationship with the Lord through Krishna consciousness and by the mercy of our acaryas. That is what we should look at and then the Lord will come to you personally.

I think that whether you are a man or woman whether you are a Muslim or a lowborn person, those are temporary external designations or upadis. The real thing is as Sesa Prabhu was saying the fruit of the endeavor for Krishna consciousness is to develop a very intimate personal relationship with the spiritual master and Krishna. No one can in any way violate that or stop it!

Sesa Prabhu: Thank you. I think it is a little late so we will end the class there.

Grantharaj Srimad Bhagavatam ki jai!

(Applause)